Farewell Ambrosia Society

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Farewell Ambrosia Society

Post by Mcpato » Thu Jul 30, 2020 11:58 pm

Today, finally I suppose, a great resource and repository of unique knowledge is gone. I was "watching over" the forums there to help anyone who desired to cultivate the fleece themselves. I will continue to do so here. Perhaps it is only me who cares, but having finally found and cultivated the fleece after a years hard and unsuccessful work, I truly believe in the fleece that became the life's work of Donald Teeter. Unlike Teeter, I believe it is actually a mold. However like teeter, I believe this mold to be at least as sacred as the mushroom it is derived from. I just wanted the world to know. This site holds the last of us working with the fleece, that I'm aware of. Perhaps it is time that I begin to work on a small instruction guide, that I believe may help those who want to begin. I believe I've discovered a few improvements over teeters book... which I have no idea if it's even available anymore? Anyways thank you for my reading my short epitaph for the lost https://ambrosiasociety.org.
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Re: Farewell Ambrosia Society

Post by Amanita Research » Tue Aug 04, 2020 8:44 am

Ah, that's sad. What happened? Why did they pack up shop? I sent them a message offering support years ago but never heard back from them.

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Re: Farewell Ambrosia Society

Post by Mcpato » Wed Aug 05, 2020 2:54 am

I have no clue. The forum has been basically dead for a few years now. The past year I've acted there to help people, and often refered them here for the more active community. Seems to me the ambrosia society has run out of steam. I'm not even a member but I feel like I'm the last one they have left. Lolol
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Re: Farewell Ambrosia Society

Post by Hasler » Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:18 pm

I would have never known what the Fleece were if it wasn't for the Ambrosia Society and this Forum, I don't practice it but I'm Amazed of the practice of it, how it work's in the stomach, I've read a few post's here in the Forum on how it works and the benefits, cool stuff 8-)

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Re: Farewell Ambrosia Society

Post by amanitadreamer » Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:46 pm

Mcpato wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 11:58 pm
Today, finally I suppose, a great resource and repository of unique knowledge is gone. I was "watching over" the forums there to help anyone who desired to cultivate the fleece themselves. I will continue to do so here. Perhaps it is only me who cares, but having finally found and cultivated the fleece after a years hard and unsuccessful work, I truly believe in the fleece that became the life's work of Donald Teeter. Unlike Teeter, I believe it is actually a mold. However like teeter, I believe this mold to be at least as sacred as the mushroom it is derived from. I just wanted the world to know. This site holds the last of us working with the fleece, that I'm aware of. Perhaps it is time that I begin to work on a small instruction guide, that I believe may help those who want to begin. I believe I've discovered a few improvements over teeters book... which I have no idea if it's even available anymore? Anyways thank you for my reading my short epitaph for the lost https://ambrosiasociety.org.
What I would really like to see happen now and here on this forum, since we started as a science based place to help stop the spread of mis-information and to bring some good solid information forward, is this.... I would like to see the talk of fleece being amanita mycellium come to an end. I would like the use of the word "believe" in relation to it, to stop, in favor of, the fleece IS mold. It's been tested, it is mold. In this way we can start to move forward. It's my opinion that that's why AS died out. Once the science got involved and showed the fleece wasn't the resurrected "body" of the christ (the mushroom) it's like the science based people left and the magical thinkers sort of knew inside something magical had died. And it needed to so that it could all move forward.
To me you don't have to choose between magical thinking and science. All of this is magical to me. Fungi are magical beings. But the magic should stay in the ethereal, the emotional and the wonder. And the facts, the growing, how it grows, how it multiplies, should stay in the science. THAT it is wonderous shouldn't be changed by understanding the science of it. And like you said, the benefits of a mold that only grows on amanita, OR the only mold that amanita makes, there's something beautiful there, and indeed resurrecting. Let's work to understand the science, not use words like "believe" when we have the science, and let's set statements and boundaries for that moving forward. Let's clear the past and work to find what now....
For me the questions are these...
What role did grapes play in this mold?
Can other foods do the same?
Are there actually mind altering substances in this mold?
What are all the ways this mold can be grown?
Can this mold grow on other amanitas? Other fungi? Other foods?
To me, these are the questions that would really help move all this forward. Am I forgetting any?
I realize this will rule out the magical hope that you, whoever the you is, will be world famous for discovering something completely contrary to modern science and that you will be famous in all circles for solving anciet mysteries but there isn't an ancient mystery or something acting outside science to find. And maybe someday this place will be pointless. Hopefully we will learn all there is to know about our amanita and it will be common knowledge for the masses who use it well and in friendship with the mycellium. That's sort of the end goal here, spreading education and information, eventually, we should reach the end and maybe we just become of place of amanita worship all over again, coming full circle. :)
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Re: Farewell Ambrosia Society

Post by Mcpato » Thu Aug 06, 2020 4:04 am

amanitadreamer wrote:
Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:46 pm

What I would really like to see happen now and here on this forum, since we started as a science based place to help stop the spread of mis-information and to bring some good solid information forward, is this.... I would like to see the talk of fleece being amanita mycellium come to an end.
I don't think anyone disagrees with you there. I'm definitely in the fleece as mold camp.
I would like the use of the word "believe" in relation to it, to stop, in favor of, the fleece IS mold. It's been tested, it is mold. In this way we can start to move forward. It's my opinion that that's why AS died out. Once the science got involved and showed the fleece wasn't the resurrected "body" of the christ (the mushroom) it's like the science based people left and the magical thinkers sort of knew inside something magical had died. And it needed to so that it could all move forward.
It's not that I don't agree with you here, but DO we have the science? My own subjective experiments point to it being very much a mold, in fact it appears similar in many ways to the Tempeh mold, but I've only heard rumors of the fleece being lab tested, and I've never seen any documents, or even references on who might have the research. I, like you, want to get past the uncertainty, but the fact is we are uncertain about a lot of things surrounding this mold, because as far as I've found, the Ambrosia Society is the only one interested enough to do any work on it, now they are most likely gone for good. Then there are people like me who aren't members of the AS or mycologists, but can see obvious value when others only see fear. We can experiment to see what is possible, and will happily share our discoveries with the world... but it does feel disingenuous to say "we know", especially if we actually start believing it enough that we decide we never need look any deeper. Maybe I'm playing devils advocate, but I don't mean to. I haven't seen any science whatsoever, again only rumors...
To me you don't have to choose between magical thinking and science. All of this is magical to me. Fungi are magical beings. But the magic should stay in the ethereal, the emotional and the wonder. And the facts, the growing, how it grows, how it multiplies, should stay in the science. THAT it is wonderous shouldn't be changed by understanding the science of it. And like you said, the benefits of a mold that only grows on amanita, OR the only mold that amanita makes, there's something beautiful there, and indeed resurrecting. Let's work to understand the science, not use words like "believe" when we have the science, and let's set statements and boundaries for that moving forward. Let's clear the past and work to find what now....
For me the questions are these...
What role did grapes play in this mold?
Don Teeter spent a lot of time exploring this, and theorized that the ambrosia made from the grapes was actually the first purposely cultivated ancient wine, perhaps even the reason why wine was so important in the ancient world. I know many who aren't familiar with the fleece in the least would roll their eyes at the thought since we "know" that wine is made from alcohol, but there is strong precedent to examine the theory more deeply, which he does go into in his book. First, the psychoactive effect is superior to wine, at least that is how most feel when they experience it, including me. 2nd, ancient texts often recommend adding water to wine. With ambrosia this somehow strengthens it's psychoactive effects, while with alcoholic wine it diminishes it's effects.
Can other foods do the same?
I have yet to find a food that the fleece does not grow upon. Different techniques need to be used to help the mold along, but from meat, to dairy, to all manner of vegetation I've had success.
Are there actually mind altering substances in this mold?
the only reason I can tell that there is any debate about the psychoactivity whatsoever in the fleece is that there is a strong aversion for people to try it before the science dictates it is safe. No question that it is psychoactive. Is it ibotenic acid? It feels similar to me but i wouldn't at all be surprised if it was some analogue. It also passes in the urine to be "recycled" if wished, to great effect. Seriously, if anyone wants to see for themselves it's easy to start, just don't make the mistake most beginners make and start with tying to make ambrosia. Start with the living bread so the mold will be clean, THEN make the wine. :) I'm dedicated to helping anyone at all, and have shown what I've learned in these forums as well! Is it safe? I believe anyone with a healthy immune system would find it is safe, and drying the bread at a high enough heat to neutralize the spores AND covert it to muscimol (or it's analogue?) would be more than sufficient to remove all doubt. A. Pantherina derived fleece has the same psychoactive effect, but an added toxin that hurts the internal organs if taken. It isn't more potent than Muscaria fleece so I don't work with it anymore. I'm fairly certain other varieties of amanita would have psychoactive fleece as well, and look forward to experimenting as i get specimens to work with!
What are all the ways this mold can be grown?
Ambrosia, living bread, psychoactive tempeh (beans, soybeans, chickpeas, etc.), the "grail" including my "reverse grail" have all shown success. These have been my main areas of experimentation and I look forward to anyone's ingenious suggestions! This is like a new frontier. Many exciting experiments are currently being done using the koji mold, like vegan "sausages" that i believe coukd be done with the fleece with exciting effect! We need adventurous explorers to experiment and unlock its untapped potential! Imagine psychoactive steaks and sausages, or miso, ect!
Can mold grow on other amanitas? Other fungi? Other foods?
I believe so!
To me, these are the questions that would really help move all this forward. Am I forgetting any?
these are a great starting place in my opinion!
I realize this will rule out the magical hope that you, whoever the you is, will be world famous for discovering something completely contrary to modern science and that you will be famous in all circles for solving anciet mysteries but there isn't an ancient mystery or something acting outside science to find. And maybe someday this place will be pointless. Hopefully we will learn all there is to know about our amanita and it will be common knowledge for the masses who use it well and in friendship with the mycellium. That's sort of the end goal here, spreading education and information, eventually, we should reach the end and maybe we just become of place of amanita worship all over again, coming full circle. :)
I love the amanita mushroom and I love the fleece. There is so much to explore and discover here, I doubt it's going away anytime soon, but rest assured I'm not interested in any acclaim or prestige from my work with the fleece, I only believe it is more than worthy of our sincerest attention to unravel it's rightful place in our lives. It has been a major blessing for me and I don't doubt many others would arrive at the same conclusions and greater if the fleece were lifted out of obscurity. I appreciate all your work @amanitadreamer and thank you for bringing this to the public's eye. I think I really want to pick up the torch that Donald Teeter dropped and further this cause in my own way, since there didn't seem to be anyone else wanting to do it. We are all on the same team here, and I recognize the importance of moving forward in scientific ways. Hopefully more scientists will agree and feel motivated to help! Thank you so much!
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Re: Farewell Ambrosia Society

Post by tgt1002 » Thu Aug 06, 2020 5:07 am

Mcpato wrote:
Thu Aug 06, 2020 4:04 am
amanitadreamer wrote:
Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:46 pm

What I would really like to see happen now and here on this forum, since we started as a science based place to help stop the spread of mis-information and to bring some good solid information forward, is this.... I would like to see the talk of fleece being amanita mycellium come to an end.
I don't think anyone disagrees with you there. I'm definitely in the fleece as mold camp.
I would like the use of the word "believe" in relation to it, to stop, in favor of, the fleece IS mold. It's been tested, it is mold. In this way we can start to move forward. It's my opinion that that's why AS died out. Once the science got involved and showed the fleece wasn't the resurrected "body" of the christ (the mushroom) it's like the science based people left and the magical thinkers sort of knew inside something magical had died. And it needed to so that it could all move forward.
It's not that I don't agree with you here, but DO we have the science? My own subjective experiments point to it being very much a mold, in fact it appears similar in many ways to the Tempeh mold, but I've only heard rumors of the fleece being lab tested, and I've never seen any documents, or even references on who might have the research. I, like you, want to get past the uncertainty, but the fact is we are uncertain about a lot of things surrounding this mold, because as far as I've found, the Ambrosia Society is the only one interested enough to do any work on it, now they are most likely gone for good. Then there are people like me who aren't members of the AS or mycologists, but can see obvious value when others only see fear. We can experiment to see what is possible, and will happily share our discoveries with the world... but it does feel disingenuous to say "we know", especially if we actually start believing it enough that we decide we never need look any deeper. Maybe I'm playing devils advocate, but I don't mean to. I haven't seen any science whatsoever, again only rumors...
To me you don't have to choose between magical thinking and science. All of this is magical to me. Fungi are magical beings. But the magic should stay in the ethereal, the emotional and the wonder. And the facts, the growing, how it grows, how it multiplies, should stay in the science. THAT it is wonderous shouldn't be changed by understanding the science of it. And like you said, the benefits of a mold that only grows on amanita, OR the only mold that amanita makes, there's something beautiful there, and indeed resurrecting. Let's work to understand the science, not use words like "believe" when we have the science, and let's set statements and boundaries for that moving forward. Let's clear the past and work to find what now....
For me the questions are these...
What role did grapes play in this mold?
Don Teeter spent a lot of time exploring this, and theorized that the ambrosia made from the grapes was actually the first purposely cultivated ancient wine, perhaps even the reason why wine was so important in the ancient world. I know many who aren't familiar with the fleece in the least would roll their eyes at the thought since we "know" that wine is made from alcohol, but there is strong precedent to examine the theory more deeply, which he does go into in his book. First, the psychoactive effect is superior to wine, at least that is how most feel when they experience it, including me. 2nd, ancient texts often recommend adding water to wine. With ambrosia this somehow strengthens it's psychoactive effects, while with alcoholic wine it diminishes it's effects.
Can other foods do the same?
I have yet to find a food that the fleece does not grow upon. Different techniques need to be used to help the mold along, but from meat, to dairy, to all manner of vegetation I've had success.
Are there actually mind altering substances in this mold?
the only reason I can tell that there is any debate about the psychoactivity whatsoever in the fleece is that there is a strong aversion for people to try it before the science dictates it is safe. No question that it is psychoactive. Is it ibotenic acid? It feels similar to me but i wouldn't at all be surprised if it was some analogue. It also passes in the urine to be "recycled" if wished, to great effect. Seriously, if anyone wants to see for themselves it's easy to start, just don't make the mistake most beginners make and start with tying to make ambrosia. Start with the living bread so the mold will be clean, THEN make the wine. :) I'm dedicated to helping anyone at all, and have shown what I've learned in these forums as well! Is it safe? I believe anyone with a healthy immune system would find it is safe, and drying the bread at a high enough heat to neutralize the spores AND covert it to muscimol (or it's analogue?) would be more than sufficient to remove all doubt. A. Pantherina derived fleece has the same psychoactive effect, but an added toxin that hurts the internal organs if taken. It isn't more potent than Muscaria fleece so I don't work with it anymore. I'm fairly certain other varieties of amanita would have psychoactive fleece as well, and look forward to experimenting as i get specimens to work with!
What are all the ways this mold can be grown?
Ambrosia, living bread, psychoactive tempeh (beans, soybeans, chickpeas, etc.), the "grail" including my "reverse grail" have all shown success. These have been my main areas of experimentation and I look forward to anyone's ingenious suggestions! This is like a new frontier. Many exciting experiments are currently being done using the koji mold, like vegan "sausages" that i believe coukd be done with the fleece with exciting effect! We need adventurous explorers to experiment and unlock its untapped potential! Imagine psychoactive steaks and sausages, or miso, ect!
Can mold grow on other amanitas? Other fungi? Other foods?
I believe so!
To me, these are the questions that would really help move all this forward. Am I forgetting any?
these are a great starting place in my opinion!
I realize this will rule out the magical hope that you, whoever the you is, will be world famous for discovering something completely contrary to modern science and that you will be famous in all circles for solving anciet mysteries but there isn't an ancient mystery or something acting outside science to find. And maybe someday this place will be pointless. Hopefully we will learn all there is to know about our amanita and it will be common knowledge for the masses who use it well and in friendship with the mycellium. That's sort of the end goal here, spreading education and information, eventually, we should reach the end and maybe we just become of place of amanita worship all over again, coming full circle. :)
I love the amanita mushroom and I love the fleece. There is so much to explore and discover here, I doubt it's going away anytime soon, but rest assured I'm not interested in any acclaim or prestige from my work with the fleece, I only believe it is more than worthy of our sincerest attention to unravel it's rightful place in our lives. It has been a major blessing for me and I don't doubt many others would arrive at the same conclusions and greater if the fleece were lifted out of obscurity. I appreciate all your work @amanitadreamer and thank you for bringing this to the public's eye. I think I really want to pick up the torch that Donald Teeter dropped and further this cause in my own way, since there didn't seem to be anyone else wanting to do it. We are all on the same team here, and I recognize the importance of moving forward in scientific ways. Hopefully more scientists will agree and feel motivated to help! Thank you so much!
You actively cultivate and experiment with this fleece if I understand correctly. Surely there is a lab that will run tests if we pay them. I'm happy to help fund this just need to know where to send it and have you send it. Depending on cost I'll either cover the whole thing to feed my own curiosity or we can start a internal crowd fund I'm sure there will be no problem getting funds arranged. I say we stop talking about it and get it done.
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Re: Farewell Ambrosia Society

Post by Amanita Research » Thu Aug 06, 2020 11:53 am

@tgt1002 , I think this is a great idea. I’ll make a sticky on the general forum so we can discuss it further.

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Re: Farewell Ambrosia Society

Post by Mcpato » Sat Aug 29, 2020 1:23 pm

IT'S BACK!
I discovered today that the Ambrosia Society's website has come back. While I am personally very happy about it, I realize that I feel it is important to be independent in our efforts to understand the fleece. That website is a repository of old, yet valuable knowlege. I feel this forum is the next step forward. We can take the old knowledge and apply it in New ways. We already have been. I'm not a member of the Ambrosia Society, but I feel grateful that they pointed me at the Amanita Mushroom, and the secret fleece within it. That is powerful knowledge available to anyone anywhere. If you love the amanita mushroom, and if you havent already, read the book by Don Teeter that can be downloaded at Ambrosiasociety.org. Get it before it dies permanently this time. Lolol actually maybe the site will "resurrect" every time, just like the fleece?
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Re: Farewell Ambrosia Society

Post by mycholys » Mon Nov 02, 2020 4:34 pm

hello every body i jump on your tread

since 2 month i work with the fleece

i started from an isolation on agar plate from amanita muscaria and pantherina ( to much contaminant starting direclty from dryed sample collected in the nature )

from the microscope observation their are definitely from the mucor rhizopus family

the mucor from A.Pantherina present gray shade and shorter columella than the mucor from A.Muscaria


i greew it with good result on :

grape juice
apple juice
water + honey

rice
corn
barley

the mucor look like to be able to grow in aerobic and anaerobic environment

i tried to drink the fleece ambrosia wine after 21 days : no effect or very littles
same result with the living bread

so i infused the bred in the ambrosia wine expecting a stronger effect but same little effect hard to differentiate from a placebo effect

any body had a real psychedelic experience with it ?

i do not think be growing not the good mucor because
i tried different Amanita sample for be sure to identify the only mucor common to all the samples
when i compare my mucor to the ambrosia society pictures they really look like same
my wine is showing the same reaction with the sugar than in ambrosia society video


many questions :

-mucor have a psychoactive effect? ( any real trip report ? )
-the mucor do produce any active substance ? should be interesting to analyses a wine sample before and after to the heat process ( i am already contacting differents labs)
-some mucor are know for produce organic acid : ergo
-do an analysis for : iboteic acid , muscinol, and derivates + ergo derivates
- some mucor are know for food intoxication , the same mucor can be toxic or not : depend of the support/ nutriment
- the compound production from Amanita mucor it is affected by the growing support ? ( if it produce any compound )
- mucor are know to parasite Agarical , maybe it is an unknown mucor parasiting A.Muscaria and a different cultivar for A. Pantherina?
- can be a symbiosis of differents mucor or/and bacteries ?
- what is his relation with Amanita Muscaria ?
- if we can grow it easily on any substrat with sugar why we do not found naturally this mucor on other place than A;muscaria ?



i had many strong and life changing experience with Amanita but untill now nothing with the fleece

any info ? any experiences ?

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