Creating conditions to encourage Amanita to bind with a host

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thevoluntaryway
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Creating conditions to encourage Amanita to bind with a host

Post by thevoluntaryway » Thu Oct 22, 2020 5:44 pm

I've only begun using agar for mushroom spore germination and have never tried sprouting pine seeds but...

I think I've seen posts from people that have germinated Amanita spores on agar so...

If pine seeds were sprouted on something clean, like kitchen paper soaked with pure water (or only the minimum additional nutrients) and then placed onto agar that has already been colonised by Amanita mycelia, I'd like to think that would create a better than fair chance of Amanita binding with that seedling. The mycelia and root interaction might even be visably detectable.
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Re: Creating conditions to encourage Amanita to bind with a host

Post by amanitadreamer » Thu Oct 22, 2020 6:11 pm

thevoluntaryway wrote:
Thu Oct 22, 2020 5:44 pm
I've only begun using agar for mushroom spore germination and have never tried sprouting pine seeds but...

I think I've seen posts from people that have germinated Amanita spores on agar so...

If pine seeds were sprouted on something clean, like kitchen paper soaked with pure water (or only the minimum additional nutrients) and then placed onto agar that has already been colonised by Amanita mycelia, I'd like to think that would create a better than fair chance of Amanita binding with that seedling. The mycelia and root interaction might even be visably detectable.
We know that only established trees at least 4 years old are needed because the mycellium needs the sugars that are made through photosynthesis. We know that they need a specific pH but also we have found bacteria needed in the soil. We know that they process information through the mycellium and that unlike fungi that just break down substances, the ones that are mycorhyzzal need to perform communication functions in order to process information on what is needed from them in order to grow. There's a reason young trees and then much older trees work with them but we don't know what those reasons are. We know these relationships are highly complex and we have only scratched the surface on this, enough to know that we know almost nothing except how complex it is.
There is also no scientific proof to support the growth of mycellium but rather, the mold that grows on some mushrooms.
I'm not saying that mycellium and seedlings don't form their bond at that very early stage and that they help each other and then fruiting happens at year 3 or 4. That's as a good a hypothesis as any. Just saying it's only one of literally hundreds of possibilities. Having said that, all we are doing here is shooting in the dark and seeing what we get. I hope you keep us posted on your process and progress and it makes me happy someone else is thinking about growth in the ground and trying to experiment with those relationships.
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Re: Creating conditions to encourage Amanita to bind with a host

Post by Rebis » Thu Nov 05, 2020 6:26 pm

thevoluntaryway wrote:
Thu Oct 22, 2020 5:44 pm
I've only begun using agar for mushroom spore germination and have never tried sprouting pine seeds but...

I think I've seen posts from people that have germinated Amanita spores on agar so...

If pine seeds were sprouted on something clean, like kitchen paper soaked with pure water (or only the minimum additional nutrients) and then placed onto agar that has already been colonised by Amanita mycelia, I'd like to think that would create a better than fair chance of Amanita binding with that seedling. The mycelia and root interaction might even be visably detectable.
Try it and see. If you don't experiment you will never know.

Good luck.
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Re: Creating conditions to encourage Amanita to bind with a host

Post by bigsalisr » Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:22 am

I thought that the amanita at one time did eat decay, but went extinct and came back getting its nourishment from the roots of coniferous trees and the trees let this happen because the amanita gives the trees oxygen, maybe. So wouldn’t root and mycelium need to merge and be almost or rather symbiotic?

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Re: Creating conditions to encourage Amanita to bind with a host

Post by bigsalisr » Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:24 am

This is intriguing!

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Re: Creating conditions to encourage Amanita to bind with a host

Post by Garden gnome » Wed Nov 24, 2021 5:10 pm

Ehm, so did anyone actually ever establish an inocculation with the mushrooms under the host trees and what percentage success was there, on average? I'm just very curious about this and would in fact put a lot of time into inocculating on random walks. That would be something i would enjoy massively. I mainly see them growing around birches that are middle aged to geriatric. Not a lot of pine in this area but also not a lot of birches, but definitely more than pine. I would have to travel north to find the drenthe pine forests. Wilder and sandier up there. I have clear mental images of where they are supposed to grow. Please so, did and percentage?
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Re: Creating conditions to encourage Amanita to bind with a host

Post by Croneofthewoods » Fri Nov 26, 2021 10:37 pm

Garden gnome wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 5:10 pm
Ehm, so did anyone actually ever establish an inocculation with the mushrooms under the host trees and what percentage success was there, on average? I'm just very curious about this and would in fact put a lot of time into inocculating on random walks. That would be something i would enjoy massively. I mainly see them growing around birches that are middle aged to geriatric. Not a lot of pine in this area but also not a lot of birches, but definitely more than pine. I would have to travel north to find the drenthe pine forests. Wilder and sandier up there. I have clear mental images of where they are supposed to grow. Please so, did and percentage?
No idea exactly the success rate but amanita dreamer has had success.
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Re: Creating conditions to encourage Amanita to bind with a host

Post by Garden gnome » Sat Nov 27, 2021 9:03 am

Ohh right! I have seen that by now, and i think that is an interesting method. I also follow principles and methods of regenerative agriculture (yes, the BIG GUYS) very closely, specifically the channels of John Kempf (AEA, Advancing Eco Agriculture) and a company called Plant Health Cure BV. (PHC) led by an entrepeneur with massive volumes of experience in this field, called Pius Floris. who advocate for inocculation of agricultural and horticultural crops with fungi and microbial life. ( ecto, endo, the whole helpful spectrum) PHC specifically has videos on how to inocculate trees and shrubs, by using an injector nozzle on a backpack sprayer. I thought that was interesting, as you need it to get to the roots. You can not wash in spores like you can not wash in a pingpong ball is somehing he said. Biology will do that over time, of course, but what if there is no effective biology there (in the case of agricultural land and sterile potting media) i imagine forested areas of some age are still doing ok. Thank you for your reply. I very much enjoy and appreciate that.
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Re: Creating conditions to encourage Amanita to bind with a host

Post by Garden gnome » Mon Nov 29, 2021 7:55 pm

Hey, this is kind of interresting. This guy did manage to cultivate the AM mycelium. I guess it can be done. Don't know how useful it is. Probaby not at all, but technically, it can't be said it can't be done. For fruiting bodies you still need a tree. Just something interresting and fun to watch for you guys.

Been watching this channel for a long time. Absolutely love this guy as i am into botany. (obligate trigger warning, foul language, don't die laughing)

The redhead myco guy is the channel owners friend.

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